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Theory of mind

Postby magentabluesky » Mon Dec 17, 2018 9:06 pm

Frank wrote:Please be sure you know what you don't know, before you start . . .

Frank

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Theory of mind

Theory of mind is the ability to attribute mental states—beliefs, intents, desires, emotions, knowledge, etc.—to oneself, and to others, and to understand that others have beliefs, desires, intentions, and perspectives that are different from one's own.

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The Development of Theory of Mind in Early Childhood

The most important development in early childhood social cognition is the development of theory of mind. Its development during the first five years of life is described in this article, as well as factors that influence its development, and the consequences of its development for children’s lives at home and school.

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This is good information to know when teaching students and interacting with other hang glider pilots. An understanding that the student or other pilot may not know what you know.
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Re: Theory of mind

Postby Bob Kuczewski » Tue Dec 18, 2018 10:20 am

A dozen 5 year olds are playing in Jack's back yard.

Jack decides that he doesn't like what Joe says, so Jack shoves him down. Then Jack makes Joe leave. Joe goes over to play in another yard.

Some of the other 5 year olds leave and go with Joe. The remaining 5 year olds prefer Jack's toys so they stay to play with Jack.

What does the "Theory of Mind" say about the social development and maturity of the two groups?
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Re: Theory of Jack

Postby Rick Masters » Tue Dec 18, 2018 12:21 pm

Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack
Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack

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Re: Theory of Jack

Postby Bob Kuczewski » Wed Dec 19, 2018 4:04 am

Rick Masters wrote:Jack Jack Jack Jack Jack ...

Join a National Complain Aboout Jack Organization: US Hawks at ushawks.org


A fairer criticism might be:

Join a National Complain Aboout Paragliding Organization ...


or possibly:

Join a National Complain Aboout USHPA Organization ...


But we're not either of those. We're a national hang gliding association and our members have a forum where they can talk freely about what they feel helps the sport of hang gliding and what they feel hurts the sport of hang gliding. The topics of paragliding, USHPA, and hanggliding.org are all appropriate for discussion.

My question to Michael Grisham remains unanswered:

Bob Kuczewski wrote:What does the "Theory of Mind" say about the social development and maturity of the two groups?
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Re: Theory of mind

Postby Free » Wed Dec 19, 2018 10:49 am

magentabluesky wrote:
This is good information to know when teaching students and interacting with other hang glider pilots. An understanding that the student or other pilot may not know what you know.


What information exactly? The gist I got from the link was more a concern on how to socially indoctrinate the child's thinking.
Look into the Prussian education system where you get 'em young and train them into boxes.
That's more the gist of what your link actually refers to.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prussian_education_system
http://www.forcedschool.com/post/699472 ... sian-model

https://www.stgeorgeutah.com/news/archi ... BqHoc1MHIU

State-directed schools find their roots in the Prussian schools of the early 19th Century. In the 1840s, Horace Mann, then secretary of the Massachusetts Board of Education, traveled to Europe to study the Prussian model of public education. He was seeking a way to change what he deemed the “unruly” (meaning independent) children into disciplined citizens.
To that end, the Prussian educational system sought to take education out of the hands of family and church with five key goals in mind. It was to create:

Obedient workers for the mines.
Obedient soldiers for the army.
Well-subordinated civil servants to government.
Well-subordinated clerks to industry.
Citizens who thought alike about major issues.

The reasoning behind such a system is easy to understand, since independently educated masses could not be always counted on to submit to their government’s objectives. Tyrants like Prussia’s Frederick William I and France’s Napoleon each used this system to build a powerful, controlling state apparatus. Other despots followed in their footsteps.


About teaching hang gliding, something I'm less and less inclined to do, yes, you don't really know what the student doesn't know.
I got a Fundamentals of Instruction certification years ago to teach ultralight students.
All forgotten now but at the time it seemed to make a lot of sense.
Last edited by Free on Wed Dec 19, 2018 11:07 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Theory of Jack

Postby Free » Wed Dec 19, 2018 10:52 am

Rick Masters wrote: Rick Rick Rick.....
Look at me... I'm having a fit.


___________________________________________
Moderator's Note: The quoted text above was not written by Rick Masters. This has been properly explained and apologized in a subsequent post as partially quoted here:
Rick Masters wrote: This isn't true.
I didn't write that.

Free wrote:I apologize Rick. It was a troll response to your troll post.
Should not have posted that with your name in the quote header.
Shame on me.
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Re: Theory of mind

Postby Bob Kuczewski » Wed Dec 19, 2018 12:25 pm

A girlfriend of mine used to say:

      "You can get happy in the same pants you got mad in."

She was one of the most brilliant people I'd ever met, and I was never quite sure when she might be speaking a new undiscovered truth or quoting someone else's wisdom that I'd never heard. I just checked up on this particular saying and found that it goes back several generations:

Happy.jpg
Happy.jpg (30.99 KiB) Viewed 2011 times

There have been a number of "falling outs" between various members of the U.S. Hawks over the years. Sometimes people just see certain issues differently. What tends to bring us back together is our core values and beliefs. We all value the sport of hang gliding. We all believe in the fair treatment of our fellow man. We may not always agree on how to support those core values and beliefs, but that's a much smaller disagreement than we would have with those who don't value the sport of hang gliding or don't believe in the fair treatment of their fellow man (see ushpa.org, hanggliding.org, and ozreport.com). So when we look around the web for places to call "home", we tend to gravitate to those places where the people share those same core values and beliefs.

I think that's why we're all here and it has a lot more to do with our shared core values and beliefs than it does with any one person. I figure that those who leave and never come back just didn't really share those same core values and beliefs to begin with. That's as it should be. If you don't value hang gliding, or if you don't believe in fairness, then you'll be happier somewhere else. But if you do share our core values and beliefs, then please remember these words of wisdom:

      "You can get happy in the same pants you got mad in."
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Re: Theory of mind

Postby Rick Masters » Wed Dec 19, 2018 8:43 pm

"Rick Masters wrote:
Rick Rick Rick.....
Look at me... I'm having a fit."

This isn't true.
I didn't write that.
This is exactly what happened on Paragliding Forum.
The worthless moderators let false quotes stand by uniting in tribal behavior because they did not share my opinion.
I saw it coming when BobK started attacking our members because they wouldn't post on a doppelganger forum.
The US Hawks has been destroyed - and for no good reason.
I had better hopes for it.
Goodbye.
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Re: Theory of mind

Postby JoeF » Wed Dec 19, 2018 10:14 pm

Rick,
Free did a satire play following a "Jack" multiplicity satire by you (a display way different from your regular solid posting).
You were streaming well in positive posting in this forum. Then within a week or so, just because one or two topics had some family struggles with the sg matter,
you seemed to turn day to night. One of the forum members has been strongly focused on a matter, somewhat like the focus you have well served many on PDMC and other matters.
Family should be able to weather variety of styles of flow.

This forum is just beginning; it is yet in a young stage. The ability to weather struggles is part of a good growing process. You will be welcomed to post on HG matters in which you take an interest.

Consider reading and participating in only the topic threads that positively interest you. Some topic threads will veer into uncomfortable turbulence; fly in it or aim to fly to other topic threads. Easy does it.

You have freely set the tone on many matters. A forum may be enriched by a variety of perspectives and sharing styles. There are many hundreds of topic threads that may be enriched by you and others. Seasons. Changes. Growth. Development.
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Re: Theory of mind

Postby Bob Kuczewski » Wed Dec 19, 2018 10:36 pm

Rick,

I echo Joe's sentiments.

If you feel that the quote was unfair, all you had to do is ask, and I would gladly add a moderator's note clarifying the matter. I think anyone reading this topic would see that you didn't write what you feel was misattributed. But if you'd like a clarification, please feel free to make a suggestion.

I will say that your proclamation that "the US Hawks has been destroyed" is also not true, and I could easily take offense if I wanted. But I believe we're better off not taking offense so lightly. The U.S. Hawks has not been destroyed, and yet I don't feel the need to add a correction or clarification to your post. It's your opinion and it's welcome to stand. Anyone reading can come to their own conclusions.

Also, unlike the forums you've used for comparison, you are not banned, and I've not restricted your account in any way. I haven't yet checked, but I would like to think that you won't delete the history of the subforum where you've had unlimited editing abilities (and still have them). The works in that forum are clearly yours, and you can delete them if you feel the need to slap this organization further. I won't lift a finger to stop you. They are magnificent works of your own writing, and they are welcome to stay if that suits your goals. But that's up to you.

Finally, I've tried to call you a number of times this past week and I just tried again. If my timing has been unfortunate, please feel free to call me any time.

Sincerely,
Bob Kuczewski
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