Sign in, say "hi", ... and be welcomed.

Re: Calling USHPA's Bluff

Postby Bob Kuczewski » Wed Apr 20, 2016 7:23 am

howie wrote:I really wish they'd have fallen short of the insurance crisis


I think they knew they had all the money they needed from the big schools from day one of the fund raising effort. The big schools make so much money that chipping in for the RRG was a no-brainer. But they couldn't say that up front or they could't get so many of the USHPA loyalist chunps to kick in and essentially give them money. USHPA is 100% controlled by the big money interests in the sport.
Join a National Hang Gliding Organization: US Hawks at ushawks.org
View my rating at: US Hang Gliding Rating System
Every human at every point in history has an opportunity to choose courage over cowardice. Look around and you will find that opportunity in your own time.
Bob Kuczewski
User avatar
Contributor
Contributor
 
Posts: 8515
Joined: Fri Aug 13, 2010 2:40 pm
Location: San Diego, CA

Re: Calling USHPA's Bluff

Postby Rick Masters » Wed Apr 20, 2016 7:25 am

I think the paragliding interests couldn't resist the free money from the hang gliding side.
Who ever told anybody that was throwing free money at you to stop?
Rick Masters
Contributor
Contributor
 
Posts: 3260
Joined: Fri Jul 15, 2011 5:11 am

Re: Calling USHPA's Bluff

Postby Bob Kuczewski » Wed Apr 20, 2016 11:28 am

dhmartens wrote:BobK's civil rights are being violated

BobK has consistently for years highlighted safety violations before they degenerated into multiple $2 million insurance payouts that USHPA (Did not win)

USHPA revoked his flying privileges which amounts to torture.

Palmaz says the RRG is owned by Flight schools, Forbes says it is owned by the members who pay dues, USHPA doesn't even know who owns it. BobK should be on the BoD of the RRG since he can sniff out troubles "BEFORE" they occur . Even Palmaz agrees we need a culture change.
    :
    :
the fact is noone has any evidence BobK has lied, if they do they can sign a statement of truth with Contempt of Court punishment.

They all back away at that point.

:clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:

You're exactly right Doug. When it comes down to the facts ... they all either back away ... or push the "ban" button.

Here's the history of my email discussion with Ken. It started out with a Torrey Hawks / US Hawks member writing to Ken about my expulsion. Ken wrote back to him:

Ken Andrews, April 16th wrote:I’ve told Bob many times that if he would stop attacking Torrey and USHPA, then I would work to get his membership reinstated so that he could fly at USHPA sites again. So far, Bob has refused my offers.


That's actually not true. I haven't "refused" Ken's "offers". I've simply wanted to know the details of what it means to "stop attacking Torrey and USHPA". So I wrote to Ken directly:

Bob Kuczewski wrote:Hello Ken (cc/bcc observers),

In a recent message to a USHPA member, you (USHPA Director Ken Andrews) wrote:

"I’ve told Bob many times that if he would stop attacking Torrey and USHPA, then I would work to get his membership reinstated so that he could fly at USHPA sites again. So far, Bob has refused my offers."
                  - USHPA Region 3 Director Kenneth Andrews, April 16th, 2016


OK Ken, I'm calling your bluff. Please write up EXACTLY - and in the form of a contract - the precise terms and conditions that I would be required to abide by for you to work to get my USHPA membership reinstated so that I can fly at what you've called "USHPA sites" again. Please write this in an unambiguous and objective manner such that it would be enforceable in a court of law.

I look forward to your reply.

Sincerely,
Bob Kuczewski
858-204-7499


Oops, Ken didn't expect me to call his bluff. Here's what Ken wrote back:

Ken Andrews on April 18th wrote:Bob,

When I originally made this offer to you on February 20, I said I was not interested in a “letter of the law” contract. I was looking for a radical change in style, a “spirit of the law” agreement, so that we wouldn’t need lawyers and this type of arguing in the future. If and when that sounds attractive, I’m here to help.

-Ken


Gee, that was a quick turn around.   :shock:      On April 16th, Ken said that he would work to reinstate my membership if I agreed to "stop attacking USHPA and Torrey". But as soon as I asked for specifics, Ken changed his tune. What is a "spirit of the law" agreement anyway? Isn't that how USHPA expelled me in the first place? They had no evidence of broken rules or violated SOPs. Instead, the "spirit" moved them, and I was expelled in a kangaroo court proceeding. So I followed up with Ken:

Bob Kuczewski wrote:Ken Andrews (cc/bcc others),

Here's what you wrote to another pilot (behind my back):

Ken Andrews wrote:"I’ve told Bob many times that if he would stop attacking Torrey and USHPA, then I would work to get his membership reinstated so that he could fly at USHPA sites again. So far, Bob has refused my offers."
                  - USHPA Region 3 Director Kenneth Andrews, April 16th, 2016


OK, what does that mean?

       Does that mean I can't take pictures of Gabe Jebb kiting without a helmet?
       Does that mean I can't tell the City Council about violations at Torrey?
       Does that mean I can't testify in court when they injure someone?
       Does that mean I can't continue to operate the US Hawks?
       Does that mean I can't post references to accidents?

What exactly are you asking me to do? Is it unreasonable for me to ask?

Just spell it out. If it's reasonable, I'm all for it. The ball is in your court.

Bob Kuczewski


Again, Ken knew that he couldn't spell out the "conditions" to be reinstated because they would sound ridiculous and/or illegal. So yesterday Ken replied back by changing the subject:

Ken Andrews wrote:Behind your back? Hah! I was pretty certain you were listening, and evidently I was right. Moreover, I’ve said the same directly to you many times.

You have the legal right to do all the things you list, as you continue to demonstrate. USHPA also has the legal right to expel you, as it has done. I’m merely suggesting that if you stop doing those things, all of them, then maybe USHPA would consider reinstating your membership. Maybe they wouldn’t; I don’t know. But I’ve offered to help if you wish to make a good-faith effort to pursue that option. I know you’re trying to make it complicated, but it’s really very simple.

Alternatively, I think it would be interesting if you decided to try building the US Hawks into a credible organization, rather than merely a website for a few people who want a public place to rant. If the Hawks were registered as a non-profit corporation, and had an elected board of directors, and bylaws, and a bank account, and dues, and a genuine membership list, then maybe it could provide member benefits such as insurance. If the US Hawks provided real competition to USHPA, that could be good for everyone.

-Ken


Think about what Ken is saying here. He is actually saying that USHPA has the legal right to expel anyone they want to if they decide (in their own kangaroo court) that the person's actions are not consistent with the "purposes and interests of USHPA". They can do this regardless of whether any rules were broken or not. USHPA has a 222 page document that outlines all of their bylaws, and what they call SOPs (Standard Operating Procedures). In that entire 222 page document they couldn't find a single rule that I had violated, so they fell back on the nebulous "purposes and interests of USHPA" clause. And they did that without even specifying what their "purposes and interests" are.

The bottom line is simple. USHPA is no longer a pilots' organization. It has been hijacked to serve the interests of large operations like Torrey. Ken is trying to be a good little USHPA Director and do their bidding, but he's swimming with sharks and doesn't know it.

When USHPA expelled me on the "purposes and interests of USHPA" clause, they gave themselves the right to expel anyone they don't like ... without needing any justification or rules broken. That's when they crossed the line from the USA into Stalin's USSR.

But Ken's last paragraph is the answer. USHPA itself needs competition so they can't arbitrarily wield the power to ground pilots without justification. That's what we're doing here at the US Hawks. Thanks to everyone helping make that happen.   :clap:
Join a National Hang Gliding Organization: US Hawks at ushawks.org
View my rating at: US Hang Gliding Rating System
Every human at every point in history has an opportunity to choose courage over cowardice. Look around and you will find that opportunity in your own time.
Bob Kuczewski
User avatar
Contributor
Contributor
 
Posts: 8515
Joined: Fri Aug 13, 2010 2:40 pm
Location: San Diego, CA

Previous
Forum Statistics

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 234 guests

Options

Return to Hang Gliding General

cron